Identity crisi s tattoos

For all of the questions I've been asked, tattoos I've done, and posts that I've read I'd like to state something... Strictly because this is something that frustrates me... I understand that everyone has the choice to get whatever they want tattooed on thier bodies and will continue to, but not by my hand. I've done some tattoo work in the past because I needed to pay bills or at the time I thought it was a clever idea. Now I've adjusted my opinion on a few topics and just wanted to ramble... Here are my most hated things to deal with... They are in no specific order. 1. hate tattoos - I will never support hate material in any way shape or form. The only tattoo that I've ever done that came close to a hate tattoo was a ww2 backpiece that contained a swastika. This particular tattoo was about his heratige (holocost family = fathers side / polish family in germany = mothers side). It was in no way supporting nazis. 2 translated tattoos - If you can't read it or verify some serious sources, I won't tattoo it on you. If you like things like this that's cool It's not for everyone. I just refuse to put my reputation on the line for a asian character that was supposed to be "wisdom" and really meant "stupid fucking white boy". Personally I don't like this kind of work because what does that language have anything to do with you... It's not your heratige... which brings me to... 3. real heritage tattoos on random people with no real connection - Ta moko, irezumi, polynesian giolo, samoa... ect ect... This pisses me off... a good 90% of people with these tattoos have nothing to do with the real heratige these tattoos. I have eqyptian tattoos but i can trace my ancestry back to eqypt... If these people are not you ancestors... Don't get these tattoos... You are wrecking someone's heritage because you think it looks cool... 4. religous tattoos - I won't tattoo a good 90% of these types of tattoos depending on the person. Anything left wing from christianity I won't usually touch unless someone is older that 25. That pentagram looks really stupid when you realized that anton lavey was a good author that was really good at NPL. The sigil of baphomet was originated from the templars in association with friday the 13th... When the templars were being tortured for answers they screamed abiphomet which roughly traslated means "the father of knowledge" which meant god. The baphomet is a stupid symbol that has nothing to do with real evil. Most people that claim to be part of these types of religion are either going through a phase or have no real understanding with the basis of it. 5 name tattoos - Jesus fucking christ... If I had a name tattoo for everyone I've dated and thought something good would come of it... I'de be done with my backpiece and more... Even if you're married I try and get people to stray away from getting a name tattooed and get something that represents thier love for thier significant other. I will however do family / memorial tattoos.... 6 celeb tattoos- This is another really big irritation... it's bad enough to want a tattoo that you saw in a movie... but to get someone else's tattoo straight up is just plain out shitty... You want it strictly because someone else has it? that's fucking stupid.. and so are you... I just wanted to ramble about things that I don't like. I can't help but be a prick asw of late because I'm missing a ton of my shit and can't even piece my machines together with the parts I want. Taz if you read this post and get a chance get ahold of me sometime soon. I need some help with somehting and had some questions about MO. Sarah and I are considering moving down to the area so she can go to school there this next year. I fell in love with it there when I wen to salem a few years back. WHEN IS SOMEONE GOING TO BE AWAKE TO FUCKING HAVE COFFEEE WITH ME IN THE MORNGINGsgdhsnaszrdghaengfbn that is all 7

You are just plain having a shitty week. I'm sorry. *passes a mug of steaming hot coffee* Rambling is good. It gets all crappy negative shit out of your head so that you can stop dwelling on it. Or at least not dwell as hard.

I liked reading your ramblings :D You should write more

pretty much... Goddamnit.. I ran out of creamer

I used to write a lot more... ducky - I agree with your post in the pot tattoo thread... beyond writing.., I think I should just start a cult.. and call it franks cult... You don't know frank...? well he knows you... and he loves you... SAY IT! Frank loves you... Frank loves everybody.... Now drink the fucking koolaid and transpire to the spaceship behind the moon... FRANK WILL BE THERE WAITING... ;) 7

Cult? Somebody say cult? I'm in! I too enjoy your ramblerants, 23, so i would be a happy disciple or chairman of the board. As i always say sometimes: "I'll believe anything once... and try anything twice!"

O, and here's some Jamaican coffee beans. If you're REALLY feeling grumpy, grind them with your teeth.

naw, it's a good rant. people are stupid. including my own family, getting ridiculously stupid tattoos because they just "thought they were cool' when their latest bf liked them. i've been asking myself the question "Let's say I go for this tattoo-apprenticeship thing. Where do I draw the line at what I'll actually refuse to do?" So far I know hate symbols for sure, unless its something like that backpiece you were describing. Other stuff... i don't know yet.

blah blah blah... I don't want to go to work tonight. Right now I'm cleaning my house and all of that great shit. I hate to sound misanthropic, but people are stupid and get really fucking stupid tattoos. Being selective is shitty sometimes when it comes to money and whatnot... This is me caring ---->. I have an idea... I think i should find a celeb with a tattoo of some samoan traditional work containing a pentagram swastika and a name... Oh yeah and a chinese character or 3... Yeah... That'd be the shit... Can anyone find me a print? cause omfg omfg... I need that tattoo... 7

I dunno.. agree with this.. -loans you some coffee creamer- If you can't speak the language, don't get the damn tattoo.. if you're not from the culture, don't get the damn tattoo.. if you're going to get a religious tattoo.. wait.. I guess I can't say anymore than you have.. and I'm not even a tattoo artist..

I know a kid who had some sort of asian characters done on the back of his neck pretty large... We all went out to eat at 2 in the morning after bar close and were in the middle of eating and this asian waitress there asks him "why the hell would you get that tattooed on you" he proptly said that it meant "angels and demons" turns out it really said "dopey and slow" I thought it was fucking hilarious... worst thing is it's blackwork... and big.... laser can get rid of it but I'd only laser shit if A i had the money B i wanted to put something else there because no matter how good the laser treatment is.. The skin does look a little off afterwards.. Even with multiple sessions... 7

Good for me I can speak/read Japanese then.. yeah? Since I do want some kanji..

thanks for the kudos 23...i was startin to feel like i was the only one that thought that way. *makes a caramel frap* (AH! i miss RPing :( *sigh* )

you know... I was just browsing around on the internet and this article reminded me of getting a tattoo that has nothing to do with your ancestry... read the part about tom cruise on the bottom... http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=five_shitty_movies

23 just e-mail me man and I will give you my cell # Let me know where ya want to be here in Mo!

straight up dude: 1- Your clients don't go to your shop to get whatever the fuck you want, if you can't deal with people's personal taste then just tattoo pigs or honey melons. 2- Tattooing an "esvastica" cross is the worse tattoo you can ever do as a human. There is nothing better to represent hate, than that. 3- if you ever tattooed for money and/or someone here and there you should put your machines away right now. I could keep writing all they long about your post, but to me you are just some random dude wanting to raise some heat in here Peace. Cravink

oh I forgot: regarding ancestry: you don't need to be a jew to get stars tattooed, or a diver to get some sharks, or a garner to get some flowers.s I have tons of jap art on me and I am italian/ argentine. So what!. Man posts like this make me want to close my laptop Cravink

So you are saying that we should just tattoo anything any client wants?...Thats the stupidest thing I have ever heard of!...In any given week we turn down at least a few tattoos that from experience, not predjudice or self agrandizement, we know the client will almost assuredly regret later in life....I guess they can always go down the street where the asshole there will put any old thing on anybody if the cash is in hand...as professionals we do have not only the right but the duty to refuse to do any tattoo that we feel is inappropriate or that we believe will be viewed as a regrettable mistake later in life.

i agree 10000000000000% with the idea that hate tattoos should be rejected, but am a little uncomfortable with the elitism displayed here at times. While it is your right to refuse to do particular tattoos, you lose credibility when you start to get overly nit-picky about someone's personal tastes.There's nothing worse than some pretentious blowhard who thinks that his or her grossly sweeping generalizations constitute a true objective measure of "quality." I have gorgeous japanese work (INCLUDING kanji by a japanese artist, so i know it doesn't say "free delivery" or anything like that) which shows my *affinity* for asian culture. I think affinity should transcend heritage. Nationalism has a nasty edge to it as well, you know. Better refuse to do any tattoos which reflect heritage because that can be representative of the scourge of nationalism! How do you know the person who wants a rune on their arm, or a particular flag isn't a Nazi? Do you relentlessly "grill" them in an "interview", or what? So don't tattoo minors, don't do hate tattoos, utilize your wisdom and experience to help guide people in their choices, but don't be a snob about it. All of this talk about trendy this, and stupid that, and blah blah blah, get over yourselves already!!!! *runs to escape the onslaught of rotten tomatoes*

i agree 10000000000000% with the idea that hate tattoos should be rejected, but am a little uncomfortable with the elitism displayed here at times. While it is your right to refuse to do particular tattoos, you lose credibility when you start to get overly nit-picky about someone's personal tastes.There's nothing worse than some pretentious blowhard who thinks that his or her grossly sweeping generalizations constitute a true objective measure of "quality." I have gorgeous japanese work (INCLUDING kanji by a japanese artist, so i know it doesn't say "free delivery" or anything like that) which shows my *affinity* for asian culture. I think affinity should transcend heritage. Nationalism has a nasty edge to it as well, you know. Better refuse to do any tattoos which reflect heritage because that can be representative of the scourge of nationalism! How do you know the person who wants a rune on their arm, or a particular flag isn't a Nazi? Do you relentlessly "grill" them in an "interview", or what? So don't tattoo minors, don't do hate tattoos, utilize your wisdom and experience to help guide people in their choices, but don't be a snob about it. All of this talk about trendy this, and stupid that, and blah blah blah, get over yourselves already!!!! *runs to escape the onslaught of rotten tomatoes*

No, cravin I'm a professional artist with some fucking taste. You may think you serve your customer... Yes in the quality aspect... But my customers serve me more than I serve them... They have my fucking work on them until they are dead... It's like a walking fucking business card... You could have went on all day about my post? Sure... Make yourself look like a fucking idiot in this forum... Anyone with even a hint of professional experience would laugh at your response... 7

RE:Identity crisi s tattoos Posted by lisavamp from IP: 65.78.99.175 on 08/18/06 You're an idiot too... Read why... "i agree 10000000000000% with the idea that hate tattoos should be rejected, but am a little uncomfortable with the elitism displayed here at times. While it is your right to refuse to do particular tattoos, you lose credibility when you start to get overly nit-picky about someone's personal tastes." Fist things first.. I don't lose credibilty when I turn someone down. They move along to the next tattooist that doens't give a fuck about thier reputation or the customer themself. I'm not being an elitist I'm being respectful to dying cultures that shouldn't be copied for aesthetic purposes... "There's nothing worse than some pretentious blowhard who thinks that his or her grossly sweeping generalizations constitute a true objective measure of "quality." I have gorgeous japanese work (INCLUDING kanji by a japanese artist, so i know it doesn't say "free delivery" or anything like that) which shows my *affinity* for asian culture. I think affinity should transcend heritage." Why do you think such things... Because you haven't the slightest clue what it's like to watch your beliefs, hardships, and way of life be consumed by the bigger better now. You have kanji tattoos? Great... Good for you... I don't give a fuck.. at least you got them from someone who knows what they were tattooing... Unlike some shit google response or a flash set. "Nationalism has a nasty edge to it as well, you know. Better refuse to do any tattoos which reflect heritage because that can be representative of the scourge of nationalism! How do you know the person who wants a rune on their arm, or a particular flag isn't a Nazi? Do you relentlessly "grill" them in an "interview", or what?" Well *gosh you make me laugh* dipshit... Nazis haven't been around for quite some time... hmmm since ww2...? People who call themselves nazis these days are just racist pricks. Unlike some tattooists yes I do talk to my customers because I do custom work. If i find something not to my liking I usually find someone for them to do the work that they want.. If it's bad enough I just tell them I'm sorry and I won't do the tattoo. "So don't tattoo minors, don't do hate tattoos, utilize your wisdom and experience to help guide people in their choices, but don't be a snob about it. All of this talk about trendy this, and stupid that, and blah blah blah, get over yourselves already!!!!" I'm long since over myself. However I maintain a level of standards for my work. You know why? Because it is my work and it's on someone forever maybe? Maybe it's because I like to do work that I want to do instead of tattooing anything random on anyone. No one bitches at guy aitchison for being selective for the work that he does or doesn't do.... So how is that any differant? You might say because he is a huge name in the industry and blah blah... here is my response... I'm not going to make an impact with tattooing volumes of people... I'm going to gain respect for finding a few things that I'm great at and sticking to them. From there it's just a matter of how many people see your work and appreciate it. So yes I am selective... Ciao 7

to 23 Enigma. Before defending your post you should read what you have written and what I have wrote as a reply. 1- The only one making a fool out of you is you by saying that you don't tattoo HATE tattoos and then stating that you did an esvastiva to someone. Either you really don't whatever the fuck you want or you don't do Hate tattoos 2- Then you state that you used to tattoo for money because you thought it was cleaver idea. 3- You don't tattoo something that that's not your proficient language???? Man I have the word "happiness" in chinese in my wrist, I know what it means, I tattooed my fiance both wrist as well. 4- You are talking about not doing 90% of religious tattoo and a few lines down you are naming Jesus Christ followed by the "F...ng" and that too me is a lack of respect towards christianity. 5- Bro, again I am not against declining a few tats due to realistic reasons but you seem to decline 90% of your work. Either you live in a town where people have a stupid taste or you really think that you are Michael Angelo because you used to tattoo one the idea was "Cleaver" and that gives you right to judge people's personal taste. I decline face tattoos, neck tattoos and hand tattoos, anti christian, and genitals. But I am not hopping you do the same. Again I agree that you should some stupid tattoos.

to 23 Enigma. Before defending your post you should read what you have written and what I have wrote as a reply. 1- The only one making a fool out of someone is yourself by saying that you don't tattoo HATE tattoos and then stating that you did an esvastiva on someone. Either you really don't do whatever the fuck you want or you don't do hate tattoos 2- Then you state that you used to tattoo for money because you thought it was cleaver idea. BK was hiring back then, why grab the needles to make some quick cash when you have so many requirements before tattooing. 3- You don't tattoo something that that's not your proficient language???? Man I have the word "happiness" in chinese on my wrist, I know what it means, I tattooed my fiance both wrist as well with the same. 4- You are talking about not doing 90% of religious tattoo and a few lines down you are naming Jesus Christ followed by the "F...ng" and that too me is a lack of respect towards christianity. You don't respect religion at all. 5- Bro, again I am not against declining a few tats due to realistic reasons but you seem to decline 90% of your work. Either you live in a town where people have a stupid taste or you really think that you are Michael Angelo because you used to tattoo one the idea was "Cleaver" and that gives you right to judge people's personal taste. I decline face tattoos, neck tattoos and hand tattoos, anti christian, and genitals. But I am not hopping you do the same. Again I agree that you should some stupid tattoos.

to 23 Enigma. Before defending your post you should read what you have written and what I have wrote as a reply. 1- The only one making a fool out of someone is yourself by saying that you don't tattoo HATE tattoos and then stating that you did an esvastiva on someone. Either you really don't do whatever the fuck you want or you don't do hate tattoos 2- Then you state that you used to tattoo for money because you thought it was cleaver idea. BK was hiring back then, why grab the needles to make some quick cash when you have so many requirements before tattooing. 3- You don't tattoo something that that's not your proficient language???? Man I have the word "happiness" in chinese on my wrist, I know what it means, I tattooed my fiance both wrist as well with the same. 4- You are talking about not doing 90% of religious tattoo and a few lines down you are naming Jesus Christ followed by the "F...ng" and that too me is a lack of respect towards christianity. You don't respect religion at all. 5- Bro, again I am not against declining a few tats due to realistic reasons but you seem to decline 90% of your work. Either you live in a town where people have a stupid taste or you really think that you are Michael Angelo because you used to tattoo when the idea was "Cleaver" and that gives you right to judge people's personal taste. I decline face tattoos, neck tattoos and hand tattoos, anti christian, and genitals. But I am not hopping you do the same. Again I agree that you should some stupid tattoos.

Seriously doubt if ya have the chinese word for happiness on your wrist...there is no chinese "word" for happiness...there is however an "IDEOGRAM for happiness in that language and it is a huge one...you have apparently mistaken Chinese for Japanese as is common.

I agree with what Taz said, 'as professionals we do have not only the right but the duty to refuse to do any tattoo that we feel is inappropriate or that we believe will be viewed as a regrettable mistake later in life.' and I personally exercise that right/duty rather often. Experience and an honest respect for the profession has shown many of us the kind of tattoos that people end up regretting and getting covered up so I think it's rather shortsighted for that to be considered trying to be an 'elitist' and/or not respecting the 'clients' wishes and I personally have no respect for any Tattoo Artist who will do whatever a client wants, regardless of how poorly thought out or just plain stupid just for the money- no matter what excuse they try to make for doing so. What some people don't seem to understand is the simple fact that some of us have been in this long enough to know the types of tattoos that are usually regretted later in life as well as the fact that some of us ain't in this strictly for the money, that and some of us actually take pride in what we tattoo on our clients...Doc

Cheers and salutes for responsible artists! That's right - responsible. Thinking ahead does not come natural to some folk, and to me, it's your duty to offer them your experience. And, as all the seasoned guys have said here, sometimes your experience tells you to say no. Alternatives include: somebody coming back complaining, "why didn't you tell me it would look like this!" It's no defence to say you were following orders. Or, you could hear from another artist: "Hey i covered up some crap from your shop." Ouch? I hope so. Or, you could be surfing around and read a post about your failure to steer someone away from a bad idea. Or, please, you might have to look at the damn thing every time the person passes your shop! So, cheers and fireworks for responsible tattooists. (whoosh! bang! yee-hah!) Every time i look at my mermaid-and-faun piece i am relieved that the artist talked me out of my design. (swish! ka-boom! for Malcolm!)

to 23 Enigma. Before defending your post you should read what you have written and what I have wrote as a reply. 1- The only one making a fool out of someone is yourself by saying that you don't tattoo HATE tattoos and then stating that you did an esvastiva on someone. Either you really don't do whatever the fuck you want or you don't do hate tattoos You're a fucking idiot.. again it was a world war two backpiece significant to a little girl hiding in a closet whilst a nizi soldier passed the room.. 2- Then you state that you used to tattoo for money because you thought it was cleaver idea. BK was hiring back then, why grab the needles to make some quick cash when you have so many requirements before tattooing. No i said that I did some tattoos that I didn't want to because I needed the money. Or sometime i thought it was a clever idea and decided to entertain the request... 3- You don't tattoo something that that's not your proficient language???? Man I have the word "happiness" in chinese on my wrist, I know what it means, I tattooed my fiance both wrist as well with the same. Wonderful... great... this is me giving a fuck... 4- You are talking about not doing 90% of religious tattoo and a few lines down you are naming Jesus Christ followed by the "F...ng" and that too me is a lack of respect towards christianity. You don't respect religion at all. That's right dickass... I'm athiest.. Wooooo... I don't have much respect for christianity... It's the biggest cult there is... I wish i could write a book that good. Now hate me for my preferance... 5- Bro, again I am not against declining a few tats due to realistic reasons but you seem to decline 90% of your work. Either you live in a town where people have a stupid taste or you really think that you are Michael Angelo because you used to tattoo one the idea was "Cleaver" and that gives you right to judge people's personal taste. No I don't think I'm the best artist out there. You're wrong when you say that I decline 90% of my work considering that I'm primarily into black and grey work, biomech, and an assortment of other shit. I don't judge someone's personal taste.. I tattoo what I want to tattoo... End of story... I decline face tattoos, neck tattoos and hand tattoos, anti christian, and genitals. But I am not hopping you do the same. Again I agree that you should some stupid tattoos. I just don't have room for it.. I like to work by appointment only on larger custom pieces..

The question this brought up for me was: As an artist, what do you actually REFUSE to do? Not just you, but all the artists. Where is the "line" for you?

I'm in total agreement with Taz and Enigma. Hate tattoos: completely unacceptable. Hate is a sign of a weak and idle mind. Obviously you have far too much time on your hands all day to sit and brew about hatred towards things you don't understand. I may DISLIKE a lot of things, but I don't HATE anyone, for any reason. Hatred breeds violence and disrespect, and hatred is almost always based on an archaic, outdated idea that has been crossedbred with confusion, misunderstanding and fear. As for the rest, I really don't have a lot to say about it. I really don't like seeing Celtic tattoos on every walk of life, and usually they have no idea what the meaning of the shape represents. It irritates me. Maybe, a VERY small percentage, wouldn't bother me. They appreciate the culture, they researched and studied the history, they researched the meanings and subtle nuances of the designs. That I wouldn't mind... but to get something "just because it looks cool" goes against the art of tattoo in the first place: a tattoo is supposed to have meaning to you; in a utopian way of thinking, a tattoo is supposed to be more than a picture... it is supposed to really hit a nerve, represent a strong feeling, and actually become a part of you. Now, on the other hand, I know what it's like to be mislabeled because of my tattoos. I have two crosses, one on each toe. I am NOT Christian. My crosses instead signify to me the real meaning of the word "crucifix", from the Latin, which means literally "to torture". The cross is not a spiritual and uplifting symbol as many believe, and it isn't meant to be that for me. It visually manifests itself on my body to represent the seperation of myself from my family, after crucifixion after crucifixion, and the crosses I will bear for the rest of my life in result of their and my decisions. However, you can see how easily having crosses tattooed can be misinterpreted.

We could be all day long posting back and forth, as different persons we all have different opinions, and different symbolism can be interpreted in different ways depending on your believes. End the story for me.

We could be all day long posting back and forth, as different persons we all have different opinions, and different symbolism can be interpreted in different ways depending on your believes. End the story for me.

Cripes! Even with my half-assed non-apprenticeship I learned to use common sense when regarding the designs. When I was doing tattoos, I turned down plenty! Mostly spouses names but there were a couple of white power designs and even a 14 year old kid (wouldn't have touched him anyway) who wanted a teardrop on his FACE! Now I don't care how into being a foot licking yes-man you are, when an underage boy is demanding a design with very serious implications on his face, you turn it down. I wouldn't have done it if he offered me 10G.

As a tattoo artist I'd imagine being picky would be a good thing in some respects. As far as any art form your reputation is built upon your work. Yes, skill is important in these regards but so is subject matter. What does it say about one who often disregards high impacting social ideas? I hate all human kind, everyone is a over zealous, self righteous prick. Did I mention overly judge mental. I wouldn't go to an artist who regularly inks swastikas into the so called neo-nazis of today. All it does is support the already absurd population of bigots. Art in its purest form is a direct form of expression from the artist, plain and simple. Just a thought, ~Xie

Your post perfectly illustrates my points. "i agree 10000000000000% with the idea that hate tattoos should be rejected, but am a little uncomfortable with the elitism displayed here at times. While it is your right to refuse to do particular tattoos, you lose credibility when you start to get overly nit-picky about someone's personal tastes." 'Fist things first.. I don't lose credibilty when I turn someone down. They move along to the next tattooist that doens't give a fuck about thier reputation or the customer themself. I'm not being an elitist I'm being respectful to dying cultures that shouldn't be copied for aesthetic purposes... ' Laughingly inadequate response. You lose credibility for being a SNOB who pretends to know what he is talking about. What better way to keep a "dying culture" alive than to pay tribute to it? Perhaps such tattoos would make other people ruminate upon the nature of culture and the fact that it is myopic atttiudes like YOURS that keep people prejudiced in the first place. Who gives a fuck if it isn't part of someone's culture? If they appreciate it in some way, or are drawn to it, who the fuck are you to make that judgment call?You aren't a scholar, you are a tattoo artist. I'm not paying for your warped opinions, I'm paying you for your artistic talent and your ability to translate and depict my vision. Isn't it better that we share information, symbolism and etc cross-culturally--maybe then we wouldn't be such a bunch of ignorant, narrowminded fucks, doncha think? No, but The Haughty Tattoo Artist thinks that everyone should stick to his or her own cultural symbolism. Well, haughty tattoo artists are assclowns. You are not the spokesperson for some precious ideology. "There's nothing worse than some pretentious blowhard who thinks that his or her grossly sweeping generalizations constitute a true objective measure of "quality." I have gorgeous japanese work (INCLUDING kanji by a japanese artist, so i know it doesn't say "free delivery" or anything like that) which shows my *affinity* for asian culture. I think affinity should transcend heritage." 'Why do you think such things... Because you haven't the slightest clue what it's like to watch your beliefs, hardships, and way of life be consumed by the bigger better now. You have kanji tattoos? Great... Good for you... I don't give a fuck.. at least you got them from someone who knows what they were tattooing... Unlike some shit google response or a flash set. ' Sure, I got it from someone who knows what they are doing. And like you i abhor trends. But what I am trying to communicate is that it gets ridiculous. When will you stop? Will you begin censoring everything you don't like because you have some arbitrary objection to it? When does the madness end? Sure there are plenty of people out there who make agonizingly predictable choices, but don't you have the psychological fortitude to deal with it and didn't you expect it to happen, knowing the sheep-like mentality of many people? I am Native Amercian (navajo and cherokee) and I am pleased to see such images. "Nationalism has a nasty edge to it as well, you know. Better refuse to do any tattoos which reflect heritage because that can be representative of the scourge of nationalism! How do you know the person who wants a rune on their arm, or a particular flag isn't a Nazi? Do you relentlessly "grill" them in an "interview", or what?" 'Well *gosh you make me laugh* dipshit... Nazis haven't been around for quite some time... hmmm since ww2...? People who call themselves nazis these days are just racist pricks. Unlike some tattooists yes I do talk to my customers because I do custom work. If i find something not to my liking I usually find someone for them to do the work that they want.. If it's bad enough I just tell them I'm sorry and I won't do the tattoo. ' Hey assclown, have you ever heard of neo-nazis? I can see also that you missed entirely the nuances delivered in the last sentence of this particular paragraph. To translate, then, I am saying that any image can harbor a unique meaning, which many people might not impart to you fully. Pedophiles can masturbate to the childrens's sections of sears catalogs. Serial killers can be influenced by Mother Goose. Good luck in delving into that particular Pandora's box. The teeming inspirations and variables within the mind are not that easy to deconstruct . I understand that yes, an obviously racist image or symbol is verboten .I agree. But if you think your screening process is entirely foolproof, think again. Sad but true. I sympathize with you on this point, because i know you want to do the right thing, and i commend you for it. I've spent the last eight years studying the cognitive processes that lead to stereotyping, prejudice, and hate, and i'm committed to ameliorating such effects by educating people. "So don't tattoo minors, don't do hate tattoos, utilize your wisdom and experience to help guide people in their choices, but don't be a snob about it. All of this talk about trendy this, and stupid that, and blah blah blah, get over yourselves already!!!!" 'I'm long since over myself. However I maintain a level of standards for my work. You know why? Because it is my work and it's on someone forever maybe? Maybe it's because I like to do work that I want to do instead of tattooing anything random on anyone. No one bitches at guy aitchison for being selective for the work that he does or doesn't do.... So how is that any differant? ' OK, i am going to go out a limb here and say that you are NOT on the same level as guy aitchison, which leads me into the conclusion that by name-dropping here, you ARE succumbing to elitism. You guys think you're rock stars or something, haha. Obviously, you want to BE guy aitchison, so this is how you justify being a snotty, pretentious prick. To be able to get away with it effectively, howeverm, you have to acheive the celebrity before the attitude. 'You might say because he is a huge name in the industry and blah blah... here is my response... I'm not going to make an impact with tattooing volumes of people... I'm going to gain respect for finding a few things that I'm great at and sticking to them. From there it's just a matter of how many people see your work and appreciate it. So yes I am selective...' I admire that, naturally. A person adhering to their principles is always a good thing. Just don't get carried away. Remember that fine line. Don't be that Towering Ultimate Authority on what is good and bad, what is cool and not cool, etc. Learn to confront change, appreciate challenges and keep growing. Because if you think you're the last word on everything, if you keep making these arbitrary sweeping judgments about what and what not to tattoo, you won't be a person of principle, you'll be a narrowminded idiot. Toodles! l

I choose my work... I have my opinions... you have yours.. 7

As far as wanting to be guy... No.. I have my own style of work... No one is going to ever dictate what I believe in tattooing... Keep your opinions... I'll keep mine... COME TO THE BEER CITY SHOW AND SEE MY WORK 7

Sounds to me like somebody got their feelings hurt by a tattoo artist at one time!.....Do ya think there could be some bitterness there??....LMAO!!!!

Wrong! :)))))))))) i've had the best artists and the best work. My personal interactions could not have been more positive. i have a DEEP respect for artists as opposed to artistes. This is provoked entirely by what i am reading here. No BS. Nice try, Taz. >;)= you seem like a cool guy, though.

plus i like to be a shit-disturber. mind you, i mean what i say. i just like to argue. hell, i'll even play devil's advocate with myself. good times! i can't help it i'm an opinionated bitch haha >;)=

Gee Lisa...that wasn't at all obvious!!...If you hadn't said so we'd never have known!!!...LOL!!!~.... I LOVE people who are not afraid to debate!!!

Hmmm....my turn to play... Your post perfectly illustrates my points. 'Fist things first.. I don't lose credibilty when I turn someone down. They move along to the next tattooist that doens't give a fuck about thier reputation or the customer themself. I'm not being an elitist I'm being respectful to dying cultures that shouldn't be copied for aesthetic purposes... ' "Laughingly inadequate response. You lose credibility for being a SNOB who pretends to know what he is talking about. What better way to keep a "dying culture" alive than to pay tribute to it? Perhaps such tattoos would make other people ruminate upon the nature of culture and the fact that it is myopic atttiudes like YOURS that keep people prejudiced in the first place. Who gives a fuck if it isn't part of someone's culture? If they appreciate it in some way, or are drawn to it, who the fuck are you to make that judgment call?You aren't a scholar, you are a tattoo artist. I'm not paying for your warped opinions, I'm paying you for your artistic talent and your ability to translate and depict my vision. Isn't it better that we share information, symbolism and etc cross-culturally--maybe then we wouldn't be such a bunch of ignorant, narrowminded fucks, doncha think? No, but The Haughty Tattoo Artist thinks that everyone should stick to his or her own cultural symbolism. Well, haughty tattoo artists are assclowns. You are not the spokesperson for some precious ideology." I do not believe that he is losing credibility for turning down tattoos which he does not feel comfortable doing. I think that is something that every good artist does am I right? As far as calling him a snob because he won't put certain works on somebody, I think that's a very suggestive statement. Yeah, some artists are snobs about turning down work, and others aren't. However, you can never blame the artist for what he/she chooses to turn down. Tattoo artists aren't you bitch just here to do whatever you want them to. This is their art, their ART...it's more than just a job...any artist understands that. When you are doing work you want to be proud of what you're doing, you put a good portion of yourself into those works of art. So don't sit here and call this guy a snob because he doesn't want his work being tainted by some guy who wanted a stupid tattoo. YES, it is the ARTISTS call as to what makes a stupid tattoo, because like I said, it's HIS fucking work. Tell me something...why would you want an artist giving you a tattoo when he obviously doesn't like the material? This would make the experience fun for no one, and you will not get the best quality of tattoo, so once again, how is this being a snob? I quite think he's doing you a service by pointing you towards somebody who will be more enthusiastic about doing the piece. "Sure, I got it from someone who knows what they are doing. And like you i abhor trends. But what I am trying to communicate is that it gets ridiculous. When will you stop? Will you begin censoring everything you don't like because you have some arbitrary objection to it? When does the madness end? Sure there are plenty of people out there who make agonizingly predictable choices, but don't you have the psychological fortitude to deal with it and didn't you expect it to happen, knowing the sheep-like mentality of many people? I am Native Amercian (navajo and cherokee) and I am pleased to see such images." You're missing two words here. One is PRIDE, the other is RESPONSIBILITY. No tattoo artist should have to "deal" with somebody getting a tattoo that the artist KNOWS the guy will regret later. They have a responsibility to make sure that their client gets the best piece of art he can, something that both the artist and the client will be proud of, even 20 years later. So no, the "madness" should never stop...making sure stupidity doesn't flood the market is imperative to maintaining the art of tattooing as something more than just a business and the credibility of this art will go downhill when people allow "trendy" bullshit to walk into their shop just so they can make another buck. "Hey assclown, have you ever heard of neo-nazis? I can see also that you missed entirely the nuances delivered in the last sentence of this particular paragraph. To translate, then, I am saying that any image can harbor a unique meaning, which many people might not impart to you fully. Pedophiles can masturbate to the childrens's sections of sears catalogs. Serial killers can be influenced by Mother Goose. Good luck in delving into that particular Pandora's box. The teeming inspirations and variables within the mind are not that easy to deconstruct . I understand that yes, an obviously racist image or symbol is verboten .I agree. But if you think your screening process is entirely foolproof, think again. Sad but true. I sympathize with you on this point, because i know you want to do the right thing, and i commend you for it. I've spent the last eight years studying the cognitive processes that lead to stereotyping, prejudice, and hate, and i'm committed to ameliorating such effects by educating people." Granted you can never fully alleviate these problems, you can at least minimize them by not doing every tattoo that walks through your door. By trust your instincts, and by turning down work which you don't feel comfortable doing. And yes, big words make you sound intelligent, however, calling somebody an "assclown" ruins that one... "OK, i am going to go out a limb here and say that you are NOT on the same level as guy aitchison, which leads me into the conclusion that by name-dropping here, you ARE succumbing to elitism. You guys think you're rock stars or something, haha. Obviously, you want to BE guy aitchison, so this is how you justify being a snotty, pretentious prick. To be able to get away with it effectively, howeverm, you have to acheive the celebrity before the attitude." This is something everyone refers tattoo artists to...being "rockstars". No, he said nothing about wanting to be like Guy, just that Guy does his own shit, when and how he wants to, yet nobody is sitting here saying, "wow Guy, you're a snob". Again, it's about the art, these guys dont have a duty to do anything on your body. Nobody said he wasnt polite about turning down work, he just said he won't do certain things. If anything I think these people being turned down are the ones being pricks for not respecting the artist's decision, and then they throw a little tantrum when they don't get what they want...talk about bitter. "I admire that, naturally. A person adhering to their principles is always a good thing. Just don't get carried away. Remember that fine line. Don't be that Towering Ultimate Authority on what is good and bad, what is cool and not cool, etc. Learn to confront change, appreciate challenges and keep growing. Because if you think you're the last word on everything, if you keep making these arbitrary sweeping judgments about what and what not to tattoo, you won't be a person of principle, you'll be a narrowminded idiot." He's not being the authority of what is cool or not. He's being the authority on what he wants his artwork and reputation to be. Besides, think we can all agree that getting a tattoo just because it's cool at the time is stupid. Times change, and people usually regret those tattoos...again, here's where that responsibility comes in. It's HIS art that he's doing...I really can't stress this enough. As an artist, your work is PERSONAL, he needs to be the very last and ONLY word on his artwork, no matter what anyone thinks. Yet, this all just falls into the category that nobody but the artists seem to understand. Tattoo artists feel they have a responsibility, a duty to the art of tattooing, that tattooing is more than a business, it's an art, and as such is very personable and honorable. Yet all these fucks think that the tattoo artists OWE them something, whether it be free advice, art, or tattoos of whatever they want. Stop being inconsiderate of the artists, and start respecting their work and decisions, no, not all of em are scholars, but that doesn't mean they are stupid either. You want to sit here and tell the artists to get over themselves...get over yourself. If you do your research, know what you're getting, and why you are getting it, while at the same time have an honest legitimate reason for wanting that tattoo...you probably aren't going to get turned down. But hate is never legit, and deceipt is never honest, so don't be straight up with your artist, and yeah, expect to get turned down. And there is my two happy cents. May abe lincoln be proud. Jeremy l

23 enigma, you sound like a judgemental asshole. some of what you say makes sense, but you list so much shit it's ridiculous. even if someone's married you won't tat a name on them? at least you're not the first and last word on tattooing. change your name to 23EMO, whiner. do you get any satisfaction doing what you do?

I hate to say it but some of Lisas tirade is based in reality...more and more it seems even the lowliest of tattoo artists are geeting that rock star attitude we hear so much about....wonder why?...anybody got any ideas? I don't think that 23 is one of those by any means...any artist has the right and duty to say "NO" when he/she feels the tattoo is inapprporiate, will be a "regrettable trendy" or if he/she does not believe that they can do the work justice ...why is that so hard to understand?...Sometimes an artist has to make the call.... get over it!

get over it. ha. sir, i haven't seen your art. i clicked a link for paintedangel.com but couldn't find the page. i have art myself, i will post soon...have been an artist since i was a kid, drew many things for people...have turned down work, but...you guys seem pretty arrogant at times, and most of the negativity comes out of the 4 people that post oh so religiously on here. granted i have learned a lot from reading you and whoever else's posts. does anyone have fun doing what they do, or do you guys just like to ream people out most of the time? no disrespect.

While I can only speak for myself, I only ream people out when they talk like buttholes or talk out their ass. I'm all for trying to help out whenever possible to anyone asking an intelligent question or offering their viewpoint, until they come on or across as an asshole or talk about something they obviously haven't a clue about and try to come on like an expert...Doc

23enigma, an asshole... lmfao. Sorry I had to. Finish up my tat and I'll get some pics of your work posted. ^_^

Actually koochiesore...we just like to ream the real uptight self important asswipes on here you know the ones who think they know what we should do and how we should do it...like you!!! Idiot!!

you guys are all agg like a bunch of bitter predators. i enjoy being an artist and it's fun an rewarding. well, thanks for the welcome. i like circulation in my young ass so I'll let your little message board world be. enjoy yourselves. i'll be back someday, if none of you are in a nursing home by then.love love.